Picky, Picky, Picky.....
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 11,458
shareholder in the making
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OP
shareholder in the making
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 11,458 |
I've read many times that a particular sub is picky regarding location, or "easy to place". I'm not talking physical size here, but rather for best sound.
I don't understand. Considering the length of low frequencies, wouldn't a good location fo one sub be just as good for the next, since it's more about the room dimensions? And, considering two subs would both be reproducing 28Hz, and 44Hz and 71.6Hz, how could one sub be "difficult to place" and another "easy to place"?
If a room has a problem with 37Hz, with a huge suckout or peak for example, shouldn't two different subs placed in the same location have the same FR issues?
In other words, I'm thinking that particular rooms are difficult...(Suck, even)... or well-designed and it's not the sub that is easy or difficult to place, but the room that causes issues.
Is this incorrect? (allowing for a situation such as having a room with a peak at 29Hz that would make a sub with a dip at 29Hz seem easier to place "in that particular room"...???
::::::: No disrespect to Axiom, but my favorite woofer is my yellow lab :::::::
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Re: Picky, Picky, Picky.....
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 558
aficionado
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aficionado
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 558 |
I suppose you are right. It's just a frame of reference. It's probably the room that is picky, could be both. Although when I had some friends bring their subs over to do a little comparison a couple years ago we found the SVS was easier to place than the EP350 or the Hsu. So ??? There are probably many factors.
"That's some catch, that Catch-22." "It's the best there is."
M22ti
VP150
EP350
QS8
M3Ti
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Re: Picky, Picky, Picky.....
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 2,854
connoisseur
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connoisseur
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 2,854 |
I am surprised you are asking the questions based on the sensitivity of those ears of yours Spock!!!
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Re: Picky, Picky, Picky.....
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,189
connoisseur
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connoisseur
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,189 |
Quote:
how could one sub be "difficult to place" and another "easy to place"?
Maybe they are basing this on the relative weight and size of the sub? I'm sure an EP175 is "easier to place" than an EP600
Seriously, I think your logic is correct. How difficult a sub is to place in a room, usually has a lot to do with the owners expectations. I suppose some of the subs with built-in room EQ might be "easier" to place, since they make adjustments for the specific room.
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Re: Picky, Picky, Picky.....
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 213
local
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local
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 213 |
would a bottom firing sub have the same room harmonics as a front firing sub ?
would a sub with a 8" woofer have the same room harmonics as a sub with a 12" woofer ?
maybe the 'ease of placement' is dependent on these and/or other variables ?
I can say i had to do the subwoofer crawl to get the flattest response in my squarish room with EP175.
Randy
Axiom M80, Ep600, Qs8, VP150, Crown XLI 2500 , DBX Driverack PA2, Focusrite Scarlet 2i4
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Re: Picky, Picky, Picky.....
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 5,745 Likes: 17
axiomite
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axiomite
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 5,745 Likes: 17 |
Quote:
would a bottom firing sub have the same room harmonics as a front firing sub ? would a sub with a 8" woofer have the same room harmonics as a sub with a 12" woofer ? maybe the 'ease of placement' is dependent on these and/or other variables ?
That's a broad question. Sound is about air movement. The biggest variables therefore are the driver size, cabinet size and location to walls in distance units. Think of the pebble in the pond when dealing with low frequency sounds. They are non-directional to the ear because of their longer wavelength.
Uh, what was the question again? I'm off track. Must be the glass of luscious Mondavi.
"Those who preach the myths of audio are ignorant of truth."
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Re: Picky, Picky, Picky.....
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 558
aficionado
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aficionado
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 558 |
Yes, it is air movement. But a 12" cone moves more air, does it not, than an 8" cone? The air from a bottom firing sub has to make a 90 degree change in axis before it reaches your ear. Plus, the air most likely disperses in a radius after hitting the floor or floor plate, which means it is hitting rear and side walls directly rather than hitting a far wall and bouncing back as a front-throw speaker would do. A speaker with a throw of 3" must have different air motion than a speaker with 2.5" of throw. I think there are more variables than we might be accounting for offhand here.
"That's some catch, that Catch-22." "It's the best there is."
M22ti
VP150
EP350
QS8
M3Ti
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Re: Picky, Picky, Picky.....
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,177
connoisseur
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connoisseur
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,177 |
I think its how each sub interacts in that same room. Before I bought the EP600, I had an Axiom mfg sub with two 10" drivers in the same cabinet - one forward firing, and one down firing. The ports were down firing as well. It seemed that I could drop that thing just about anywhere, and the modes weren't a big issue.
In the same (current) room, I've had a heck of a time placing the 600. Now, there is no comparison in sound quality - it goes deeper with far, far more impact, and is much tighter with music. The thing is simply amazing in that size of room.
Shawn
Epic 80/600 + M3's + M3 Algonquins + M2 Computer + EP125 I think I'm developing an addiction.
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Re: Picky, Picky, Picky.....
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 558
aficionado
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aficionado
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 558 |
It makes sense that it is a combination of all the factors. I guess the answer to Mark's question is that calling the sub picky is just an easy way to state the problem. In the end, all other things being equal, your room isn't changing when you replace a sub. The room is the constant. A different sub isn't going to make the room better or worse. It will just interact differently.
"That's some catch, that Catch-22." "It's the best there is."
M22ti
VP150
EP350
QS8
M3Ti
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Re: Picky, Picky, Picky.....
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 213
local
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local
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 213 |
Quote:
your room isn't changing when you replace a sub. The room is the constant. A different sub isn't going to make the room better or worse. It will just interact differently.
yea, I agree with that.
I wanna get my avia disk and meter over to my brothers with his EP500. I curious how the trim settings will affect the flatness, in his given room.
Axiom M80, Ep600, Qs8, VP150, Crown XLI 2500 , DBX Driverack PA2, Focusrite Scarlet 2i4
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