Re: Maybe Al Gore is onto something...
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 91
old hand
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old hand
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 91 |
Look, over there, a shiny thing!
LOL. I will just have to use that one. Very good.
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Re: Maybe Al Gore is onto something...
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,569
connoisseur
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connoisseur
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,569 |
“Intellectual right”, is this not an oxymoron?
Just at much as the “Intellectual left.”. When ones interpretation of the world is heavily constrained by political believes it is IMO no different than seeing the world through religious beliefs. “Secular Humanism” and it’s associated beliefs is as much a religion as any of the traditional ones. One difference however, most of worlds major religions in existence today have survived the test of time something yet to be achieved by the secular humanists. The problem for me with “Intellectuals” of any ilk is that they claim to better know how I should live my life than I do, of course it‘s always for the common good, children, small furry animals . . . . For any given individual it may be only about wanting to feel they are “doing the right thing,” but for the collective movements its about the power to make heretics like me conform to their beliefs. For the record I don’t make any effort to watch/listen to the news. NPR (and it’s affiliates, BBC, local community radio) driving to work is about all I get. If someone turns on any news at work I leave the room because it‘s all mindless crap on the boob tube and commercial radio. If the world comes to an end I will be dead and not care. If we go to war someone will call me or tell me when I show up at work. Cant’ see much else I’d need to know about that won‘t be the “talk of the town“ should I have a laps and be interested. Been on the “no news wagon” for 3 years now and I’ve got more time to enjoy other things and fell much healthier (less anger about things over which I have no control). Best thing about it is how clearly one can think when not being bombarded by constant propaganda.
3M80 2M22 6QS8 2M2 1EP500 Sony BDP-S590 Panny-7000 Onkyo-3007 Carada-134 Xbox Buttkicker AS-EQ1
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Re: Maybe Al Gore is onto something...
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 38
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 38 |
You introduced a “religious” context, I’ll extend it. I never said I was believed in “Secular Humanism”; although I unreservedly agree with a secular government. In the U.S, a president would never be elected if they don’t play the religious card. Whereas in most other countries, including Canada, you play that card and you’ll never be elected. But don’t fret, the U.S is in good company: Iran, Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan…etc. You understand. “If we go to war” What? The U.S is at war! Peace brother!!
Some people are like Slinky's, not much use however, when pushed down stairs, they make you smile.
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Re: Maybe Al Gore is onto something...
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 16,441
shareholder in the making
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shareholder in the making
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 16,441 |
even he admitted he is not a climate scientist. Yes, but he got his data from peer-reviewed articles written by scientists. You do understand the process of peer-review, I presume?
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Re: Maybe Al Gore is onto something...
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 16,441
shareholder in the making
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shareholder in the making
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 16,441 |
That's basically what I'm saying...scientists that are part of the green movement aren't necessarily providing the facts but rather their "interpretation" of them. Once they started adding or leaving out conflicting data to support their "interpretation" or "theory", imo they lose credibility just like someone who lies in a court of law....once that happens, you then start questioning the rest of the "facts". I whole-heartedly agree. Everyone should have access to the data so we can see just how many outlying points were left off to make the curves prettier.
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Re: Maybe Al Gore is onto something...
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 16,441
shareholder in the making
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shareholder in the making
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 16,441 |
“If we go to war” What? The U.S is at war! We've always been at war with Eastasia.
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Re: Maybe Al Gore is onto something...
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 6,928
axiomite
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axiomite
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 6,928 |
Is the "data" correct is the whole point.
Half of communication is listening. You can't listen with your mouth.
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Re: Maybe Al Gore is onto something...
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 16,441
shareholder in the making
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shareholder in the making
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 16,441 |
It would take a global conspiracy of scientists for falsified data -- and the conclusions drawn from it -- to survive for very long. Scientists are (only) human, and suffer from all the same faults you can see in any other profession. There are significantly more honest scientists than dishonest ones, though, and as a group they have their sights set on discovering, revealing, and explaining the mechanisms that make the universe tick.
Truth is the goal, and the scientific method is the best tool humans have ever invented for getting at truth.
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Re: Maybe Al Gore is onto something...
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 6,471
axiomite
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axiomite
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 6,471 |
+1 to Peter's defense of the scientific method. Very well said.
I wish everyone who participated in the media free-for-all that is the global warming/climate change discussion could appreciate and understand the scientific method and the work that scientists do. I get tired of talking heads on TV pretending that they know science, when I strongly suspect they were the ones in the back of the class goofing off, while people like Argon and me were up front paying attention and working hard.
Sometimes I'm tempted to take Grunt's way out and just tune out of the debate. I might also throw in there a retreat from following politics, as well. I might be able to preserve what little sanity I have left.
Bears, beets, Battlestar Galactica.
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Re: Maybe Al Gore is onto something...
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 556
aficionado
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aficionado
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 556 |
The thing I like most about those who say we humans are upsetting “nature’s” balance is the presumption that we are not part of that “nature.” Yes, we are part of nature, so any change we do should be considered a ‘natural’ change. I think this whole save the Earth movement is misleading, Earth is going to be just fine, however us… To paraphrase Carlin, the Earth has gone through much worse things than a little plastic… or CO2 for that matter. And lets not forget that indigenous peoples lived in harmonious bliss with “nature” and each other until... I don’t know about indigenous people living in harmonious bliss w/ nature, The Eastern Island Rapanui people disappeared because of reckless deforestation, at least that’s one theory. And if I remember correctly the Mayan or Aztec may had disappeared for similar reasons. Somehow humans have this thing that makes it difficult to do change when its survival is in jeopardy, human nature I guess :-) I’m interested in the climate change debate but only when the debate is coming from scientists respected amongst their peers. Yes, scientists have biases, there’re human after all, but the scientific method tries to get rid of that as much as possible. It’s the best we can do.
The sailor does not pray for wind, he learns to sail. --Lindborg
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