Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Home Theater bookshelf vs floorstanding

Thanks for the help, kcarlile, bdpf, Dr.House and Alan.

Alan, your description on VP180 is sooo alluring which makes me decide to purchase this model rather than VP150.

In my experience and deciding on two models that I think I would enjoy, if there is going to be a "what if" going on in your mind about the VP180 if you purchased the less expensive VP150 then go with the VP180. In the short run you might think you are saving money but in the long run you wind up spending more money than if you went with the VP180 in the first place.

Alan, that wasn't the point that was being made. The comparison was specifically the M2 and M60(not M80)above the bass area, because both used the same single mid-range and tweeter there. Certainly, as you point out, the M80 would have the capability to play louder and cleaner there because of the multiple drivers.

It's a curse quite a few of us share with you Alan!

But you're a very knowledgeable and admired "bitchy critic"!

Dang, you beat me to that quote from Alan. I too think it is fairly representative of the populace here on the Forum.

Another question, guys. I find that VP180 can be bi-amped. Anyone happened to compare the conter when it is bi-amped to none bi-amped? Is it a huge improvement?

It can't actually be bi-amped, because it has a passive crossover network.

Axiom charges extra for the dual binding posts in an attempt to discourage people from getting them. A few of us have wondered why they don't remove the option completely, but it's a box that needs to be ticked to match the competition.

Don't waste the few extra dollars, and just get the normal connection.

Julian, again here what you "find" isn't really there. The fact that the VP180 has two sets of terminals would be only a minor convenience on the road to the modest benefits that would be realized from true bi-amping. This would require two separate amplifiers(as the term "bi-amping" implies)and a separate electronic crossover preceding the amplifiers so that each would receive only the desired frequency range to amplify. The internal speaker crossover would have to be removed or at least by-passed, as Chris's comment implies.

These steps are nearly never taken in home audio use. Your question of a possible "huge" benefit suggests that you've read the advertising nonsense put out by some receiver manufacturers touting an alleged "bi-amp" option. A receiver can't bi-amp; it has only one amplifier outputting through several channels. The power is limited by it's single main power supply section. Distributing this power to a speaker by way of two sets of output transistors(which have no power of their own and simply act as valves to distribute the required amount of voltage to the speaker from the power supply section)instead of one can't double the available power or increase it by any amount.

I was dismayed to note the $40.00 additional that would be charged for the second set of terminals; I'd suggested that $1000 would be an appropriate premium.

Like the others mentioned the only way to truly bi-amp is with an active crossover and separate amplifier channels for all the drivers. First you would need to bypass the internal crossover and program the active crossover using a loudspeaker management system. To do this you would need some knowledge into electrical theory, crossover and loudspeaker design. You would also need schematics and/or measuring equipment.

There are benefits to this but it is not a novice project and quite costly as well. I have seen this used in a commercial efforts that have been modded but mostly for DIY speakers built from the ground up for home use.

I bi-amped my last car setup with fantastic results. I never actualy heard it with the passive crossovers so I cant say how much of an improvement the active crossovers really made in my setup but the shop that did the install did lots of A/D/S installs with the passives and they were very impressed with the final result of my setup. I used a zapco 50w x 2 for the tweets, a zapco 100w x 2 for the mids, and a alpine amp for the sub. The zapcos have a nice dsp that you can control through a pc hooked up via usb to adjust everything. Its the geek factor in me and prolly most of us that something like an active crossover / bi-amp setup really apeals to.