Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Stereo Boy, do I need some advice!

Well, I got my new M3's yesterday and finally hooked them up. I'm not happy, but I'm not sure why. In my very first post, I mentioned that I'm not an audiophile and I feel I'm at the bottom of a steep learning curve. So, I'm welcoming any advice that someone would offer. And I'll TRY to keep this short.

I should begin by telling about my old, cheap system, so please don't grimace as you read this. My receiver is a Sony STR-D-315. And the speakers I'm replacing are Yamaha NS-A636's. These are 3-way bookshelf speakers with an 8" woofer, so consequently they are louder and "crisper" than the M3ti's.

But, the problem I've always had with these Yamahas are that the sound seems to be mostly inside the big black box and not out in the room (poor construction). This is definitely not the problem with the Axiom's (and BTW, I think they look great).

I guess I thought, after reading reviews and opinions, that I could achieve a certain sound with the M3's. I do realize the differences and limitaions of a 2-way vs a 3-way speaker. And before I went for the Axioms, I also tried some Monitor Audio Bronze2's and some Athena's.

I was also trying to be cost concious. But I'm now wondering if I should perhaps bump up to the M22's to achieve the volume and range I seem to be missing in the M3's.

O.K. so I DIDN'T keep it short! But I sure would appreciate some input from the experts out there; or even somebody who's been in my shoes.

Sorry to hear that you're unhappy- I think the first recommendation would be to just keep listening and getting acustomed to the M3s. You've probably heard folks in the forum say that 'speaker break-in happens, but it happens in the mind rather than the speaker.'

Otherwise, though it's hard to talk about expectations, how are the M3s not what you're expecting in a speaker?

Sounds to me like you might be expecing the M3's to produce the same or better (bass response) sound at the same amplifier setting. May I suggest that you listen carefully to the clarity of the sound the M3's produce that your old speakers do not and then adjsut the amplicfier's volume upward. I think you'll then find clarity and bass response that will knock your soks off!

Hey, Raindance! Nice to see someonw else is up at this hour reading these posts.

To answer your question, firstly, the Axioms are not as loud as the old Yamahas. I did a side-by-side with both. As I mentioned, the Axioms have smaller woofers and no midrange, so this is not a surprise. But the Yamahas sound a bit clearer in some respects, and this again is probably due to the fact that they are two-way's.

Naturally, anything new and different takes some getting used to, but I'm not sure if what I'm looking for is not a larger speaker. And i'm wondering if the M22's would achieve a sound comparable to a 3-way system. Any thoughts on this?

Hey! Thanks for the advice; I appreciate it. And I did turn up the volume, as you said, and it did make some difference. But the Axioms seem to be missing a bit in the uppper range as well, at least to my ears. So I wouldn't be one of the people who conders them "brite".

I know my receiver has severe limitations, as well. Compared to some the equipment I've seen mentioned in these forums, mine is akin to an AM transistor set from the '60's!!

BTW, Raindance, I just checked your profile for the heck of it, and lo and behold: you HAVE a couple of M22's. I'd like to know what your impresions are. But I'm off to bed now, so I'll read more in the AM. Thanks again!

I don't think that 3 way vs. 2 way has much to do with it. I suspect that the Yamahas are more sensitive, which gives them greater volume at a given volume setting. Also, the M3s may not put out as much bass, as you said, because they're 6 inchers, as opposed to 8s. I imagine that the cabinet is smaller, too. Do you have any adjustments made to the tone controls "left over" from the Yamahas? I would suggest you put the tone controls to neutral (and turn them off entirely, if possible with your receiver). This could make a big difference. Now, I've only heard the M22s, but I was blown away by them. I'm considering the M3s or the M40s or 50s for various reasons, but I've not heard them yet. I'd also play with positioning a bit.

BTW, the M3s (& 40s and 50s) are considered (or used to be, at least) to be on the warmer side of Axiom's lineup; in other words, they're not accused of being bright as often as the 2s, 22s, 60s, and 80s.

PM, I'm not familiar with the Yamaha speakers, but I'm quite familiar with your Sony 315 and know that it has plenty of power to drive the M3s to uncomfortably loud levels. The fact that you have to set the volume control higher for the M3s indicates only that they have less sensitivity, which has no connection with quality, size, number of speakers, etc. I have the M22s because I prefer the slightly more forward and clearer mid-range they apparently have as compared to the M3s, but I don't know if that would match your preference. As far as the highs, the M3 and M22 have the same tweeter and are essentially identical there, with quite strong and smooth response. I can only guess that the Yamahas are unrealistically elevated or ragged in the highs if they sound much different. The Axiom highs are accurate. Keep listening to the M3s and don't hesitate to set the volume control higher than you've been used to.

Ah, my opinion on my M22s. let's see...

I had Wharfedale Modus 8s before these Axioms, and at first I thought they were a bit restrained on the low-end. I like a definite low-end in listening to music- something that sounds authorative. After getting a subwoofer (STF-2 from HSU), I realized that what my Wharfedales had was some sort of unnatural mid-bass bloat-- it sounded good to me because I was used to it.

I wouldn't have been happy with my M22s without a sub. With a sub to fill in the lower octaves, many cds (depending on how they've been mastered) feel extremely 'natural'- I'm happy with the sound.

Some bloat in some areas does sound good to some people-- I figured, accurate as my M22s+HSU were, I could just EQ them to sound a lot like my Wharfedales if I couldn't get used to them, but I did and things are good.

Hope this helps-
Mike

Pewterman,

if you don't mind I'd like to chime in here. This might get long.

1 - yamaha vs. m3 for volume levels. Axioms are extremely efficient speakers (little power gives louder volume). However, your Yamaha's might be even more efficient. Or, you may be confusing dB level with loud bass. You yammy's do have an 8inch woofer just for bass. But trust me, the M3's require little power to give good volume. Some people use 3 watt tube amps and it fills the room.

2 - You're extremely used to the yammy sound. I assume you had them for over a decade and listened to EVERYTHING on them? Try walking around to local audio stores and listen to very expensive and lesser expensive speakers on very well recorded material. Then try the same at home. AFter 2 or 3 weeks of listening to the M3's, you'll think your yammy's sound bad.

3 - M22 vs M3. The M22's are clearer in the midrange, are a bit more dynamic (that means they produce complicated music a bit better), play ever so slightly louder, and give a nicer soundstage than the M3's. The M3's are warmer, more laid back, give less listening fatigue, have a thicker sound for bass (the m22's are often perceived to sound thin).

4 - make sure your cables are connected properly. negative on negative, positive on positive, and please be sure that the connection is tight

5 - if your electronics are really THAT old, maybe an upgrade would help, maybe not. you could always try the m3's and someone else's house with newer stuff, just to see if it changes anything.