Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Home Theater vp150 ok with m100s?

I started buying some cd's from a discount store (new/used), and it seems almost all of the ones I buy there are poorly recorded. They must be selling mostly boot leg copies. Probably not be going back there.

Sorry if I missed it, how close to the side walls are they? I recall there being a few comments that they would need room around them.
If you can't move them you might consider placing (at least temporarily) a full batt of pink insulation or a thick drape behind and or beside them to see if it helps. I've got Roxul (safe and sound, had extra left over) between my side walls and my towers and it helped with my rooms issues. Bass traps across the rear corners helped a lot. More Ruxul, fit to the corner, +/- 24"x 24"x 32". I'll likely add more, this seemed to help the most.

Every room is different but the HTS review posted the results of their speaker shoot out.

Their distances were stated as;

56” from side wall
123” speaker to speaker
94” to listener ears
13 degree listener angle

Their back wall dimension wouldn't work for most homes, 84” to the front wall. That said they were using a dedicated theater for their listening sessions, it could be this distance was needed for more than bass control, and or used for convenience.

Read more: http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/h...l#ixzz3Dm7S24wW

You're using M100s as full range speakers if they're set to large, and you have 2 SVS 13s. Yes, that sounds like too much bass.
Set the speakers to small for sure and try using 60 Hz (or even 80, can't hurt to experiment) for the fronts. I think your Denon can set individual crossovers and you need a higher crossover for the VP150, it doesn't have much below 100 hz (I had one before moving to the 160). I agree it's overmatched but it shouldn't sound terrible.
You have beautiful equipment, I'm envious. You should be able to achieve stunning sound.

At the risk of coming across the wrong way, if I had the M100's I wouldn't be using subs (most of the time).

Yes, as other replies have pointed out, at least part of the excessive bass heaviness which you're experiencing may be due to possibly having the M100s and the sub "doubling" the bass. If you have the M100s set "Large", the crossover setting is meaningless and they play full-range, along with the sub in the lowest bass(if you have the 4308 set to also use the sub on music, with a "LFE + Main" setting).

Set the M100s "Small" with a crossover of probably 60 or 80Hz, and let your excellent subs handle the lowest bass which they do best. Also, make use of Audyssey.

The crossover changes are the most important IMO -- if I had your system I would listen to music without the subs and start with an 80 Hz crossover & Small setting for movies.

Next, if you haven't done so already it would be good to experiment with pulling the M100s out much further from the wall even if you know you're going to have to push them back before your wife gets home.

I find that ~30" between back of speaker and wall is about right for my M40s and M60s, I would go right out to 4+ feet when experimenting. Find the right distance with and without the port plugs, just so you know what the speakers can sound like. You might have to move them a bit closer together to compensate for them being closer to the listening position but that shouldn't be a problem with them so far from the wall.

I want to tell you to pick up some cheap (but decently heavy wire) long speaker cables and experiment with having the speakers on the short wall, but I've also been accused of sowing the seeds of marital discord by doing things like that.

Maybe just pull the speakers another inch further from the wall every day and see how far out you can get them before getting caught.

If you could pull them out another foot that would only take 12 days (an inch a day) and then you would probably be able to put a VP180 in *front* of the cabinet ans still have it aligned with the M100's

I'm constantly surprised by the variety and depth of expertise of the folks here -- I bet if you posted a current floor plan someone might think of a "short wall" layout that your wife would like, that would have room for the M100s to breathe, *and* would have room for a VP180.

I think that Murph hit the nail on the head. I had the M80 speakers and found them deliciously smooth with some of my tracks but sounding rather hollow and missing with others. I had to with some music crank up the bass to +6 to get it closer to sounding right.

I traded in the M80 for LFR1100 and it did make it a bit better but same tracks now needed +3 bass (i think due to the HP speakers).

Found that just getting a better recording and it suddenly sounded a whole lot better.

what you are probably hearing is that your old speakers didn't make and clear bass so you needed some big subwoofer power to get them to sound reasonable. Now you have a speaker that will play bass and when you play a recording that is done right, you are over powering the bass by having the subs adding to what the speaker is making. But the tracks that were recorded bad don't sound right as you are now missing the clearity that you now have experienced on the good tracks.

For an experiment. Turn off you subs completely. Pull the port plugs and try listening to a whole sample of music that you have. You might find that quite a bit of it sound great with just the m100's with no sub at all.

One more possible thing to consider -- I found that after treating first reflection points the system seemed to be more tolerant of less-good recordings.

If you're oriented on the long wall then the side FRPs are probably OK but think about floor/ceiling and definitely the back wall. Guessing the listening position is a couch or similar seating very close to the back wall -- if so then try holding a cushion behind your head to block reflections off the back wall from your ears (it's best if nobody is watching) while listening to a not-sounding-good recording and see if that helps.

Do the crossover first though.