Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion The Water Cooler OT: politics

about the CD thing. Why would they sell something for less than they paid for it? I assume the store would have to buy the CDs new, and pay taxes on them.

I believe purchases for resale are exempt from the national tax.

Great idea to me...I buy nearly everything used. Ebay is my friend.

I found some more analysis of the national sales tax idea. Very detailed.

It was detailed, except the model used was not based on elimination of payroll taxes, especially from the employer's end, which would drastically reduce costs to business, thus lowering business costs, and prices. Nor did it factor in the 2003 idea of a 23 % (instead of 18.2%) tax with a $3600 per year per household "pre-bate". This amounts to a $15,000 + exemption... PLUS, no payroll taxes.

It also assumes that ALL income from high income earners IS subject to tax, which it is not. Most "super rich" have vast amounts of income from tax free accounts. Not to Pick on the Kerry's, but thet paid a 12% net rate... and I don't blame them, they used the current law to their benefit.

As for cars... the free market system would, within 3 years, adjust the value of cars... used car values would rise, with the net effect being the guy trading in his car would get more on trade. And people buy new for the status, give a $100,000 per year guy ALL his income... and there will be an extra Corvette sold.

Spiff.... there would be SOME grumbling from people if this was to pass... that grumbling would be from all the people either getting a free ride, and accounts and IRS people.

I will personally kick in $10,000 to a "re-train the IRS into a productive member of society" fund...

Found a great PDF that breaks it down in plain English.

Here's a quote for consideration:

"Advocates like to assert that sales taxes are pro-family relative to the income tax. But
children and families benefit disproportionately from numerous features of the current system,
including dependent exemptions, child credits, child care credits, earned income credits and
education credits. And the preferential treatment of housing, health insurance, and state and local
tax payments also plausibly helps families, since they consume relatively more housing, medical
services, and government-provided services such as education. All of these preferences would be
eliminated under a sales tax. Moreover, compared to childless couples, families with kids generally
have high consumption relative to income, so switching from income tax to a consumption tax
would further raise tax burdens during years when family needs were highest. Based on 1996 data,
a recent study found that enactment of a broad-based, flat-rate consumption tax like the sales tax or
flat tax would hurt families with incomes less than $200,000, because of the loss of tax preferences,
but would help families with income above $200,000, due to the dramatic reduction in the top tax
rate. Incorporating the 1997 and 2001 tax changes—especially the child and education credits-—
would only exacerbate these results."

PM .. Those issues were handled in the pending bill. With the elimination of payroll taxes plus the addition of the $3600 family rebate, let's look at the current family making $20,000 ... The take home pay is about $15,000 under the current system. If they spend ALL $15000 buying new "stuff", they pay $3450 in taxes, but got a $3600 prebate. This family does not buy new cars, and often will buy used clothing, TV's, rtc... but even if they bought everything new, they would still pay no taxes.

and there is NOTHING in the bill which eliminates cheaper housing, health insurance, etc... don't get mad, but the fact that the people who did this shows a negative bias, because the tax rules have NOTHING to do with cheaper housing... etc...

I see people of all income types regularly, and EVERY couple I have talked to, when explained to how they could keep ALL their paycheck, AND get $300 in the mail, in exchange for their paying a 23 % sales tax excites them...

Remember... this bill is revenue neutral to today's code... and if the 25 % of our economy which is tax exempt (the drug dealers, waitstaff, cabbies, hookers, tax exempt accounts, moonlighting jobs... etc...etc...etc...) pays ITS fair share, the 75% of us who DO pay a fair share will get a reduction.... I like that idea... even for the Blue States

Craig,

Thanks for the info. A lot of us are still in the too-good-to-be-true phase of mulling this over.

There's a very good discussion happening over here.

PM... that was a good discussion ... even the guys spouting off were passionate without being mean...

By the Way, We have a flat tax in Pa.... you pay 2.7 % of what you make. period. I spend 3 minutes per year on my state tax.

Confessions of an Economic Hit Man: How the U.S. Uses Globalization to Cheat Poor Countries Out of Trillions

An interesting read/listen. Not surprising in the least that this stuff goes on. Do you think we'd still be the world's biggest superpower if we played fair in the world?

That was fun... better fiction than a Ludlum book... it reminds me of the guys who were into the conspiracy theories about all the people who dies around the Clintons...